The intelligence in the funnel of a volume SaaS business is actually at the top of the funnel. Sales basically becomes more of a fulfillment issue, and what you want to be is brilliant at segmentation.

I think, to get someone that's really good at all of those things. So I think I think you're absolutely right. On on the volume side, what do you want from a COO? Well, the the intelligence in the funnel of a volume SaaS business is actually at the top of the funnel. It's all about your sales basically becomes more of a fulfillment issue, and what you want to be is brilliant at segmentation and making sure you're only pursuing the leads that you know you're gonna close for no money. So if you are looking for a CRO for a volume business, you ultimately probably look for a someone who's great at that top of funnel stuff. He's a great performance, sort of modern performance marketeer, and very few of them have ever had sales reported to them. So the quandary on those people is always, yes, they haven't built a sales team. They could well, of course, they haven't because they're not a salesperson. I also just think the idea that a marketeer is very short tenure in Silicon Valley for TMOs at the moment. And I think the challenge there is who's brilliant at brand, product marketing, and then also, like, funnel management of next year's number. Like, no one probably.